Ok, here's a big one: Hell. I think this is probably the chapter that has caused the biggest transformation in my thinking/understanding of faith topics. And Here We Go! (siren) *haha, had to get the Chelsea Derby reference in ;-)
Q1: "How should we even approach the topic of hell?"
A1: "...people should try to set aside their feelings. The basis of their evaluation should be whether hell is a morally just or morally right state of affairs, not whether they like or dislike the concept. And it's important to understand that if the God of Christianity is real, he hates hell and he hates people going there. The Bible is very clear; God says he takes no pleasure in the death of the wicked."
R1: The topic of hell definitely does incite a wide range of emotional responses, so I think this was a really important statement to start off with. It's very easy to slip into a reaction to the imagery of hell rather than consider it logically. And with that frame of mind, let's continue...
Q2: How could a loving God torture someone forever?
A2: "hell is not a torture chamber...The essence of hell is relational...In the Bible, hell is separation or banishment from the most beautiful being in the world--God himself. It is exclusion from anything that matters, from all value, not only from God but also from those who have come to know and love him."
"hell was not part of the original creation. Hell is God's fall-back position. Hell is something God was forced to make because people chose to rebel against him and turn against what was best for them and the purpose for which they were created."
"Any figure of speech has a literal point. What is figurative is the burning flame; what is literal is that this is a place of utter heartbreak."
R2: Wow, lots of good points in here...ones that I have never really been able to wrap my head around before. Especially the idea that hell was created as a reaction to the actions of man. It takes the "punishment" factor out of it and presents it more as a "logical consequence."
Another important piece here is the whole understanding that "hell is not a torture chamber." I think that the imagery of hell unfortunately became far more powerful throughout history than its true nature; and it's that misunderstanding that has pushed some people away from Christianity.
With the "new" understanding that hell is not a torture chamber but that it is the absence of a relationship with God; wouldn't it be safe to say then that the majority of people on Earth are already living in hell?
Q3: "You're saying people choose hell?"
A3: "by the way we live our lives we're either preparing ourselves for being in God's presence and enjoying him for eternity, or we're preparing ourselves for an existence where we try to make ourselves the center of the universe and we have no interest in being with God or the people who love him...So hell is not simply a sentence. It is that, but it's also the end of a path that is chosen, to some degree, in this life right here and now, day by day."
R3: Man does this kind of rock our world when it comes to how we view hell...again the whole "logical consequence" comes into play. It's pretty hard to justify being mad at God for the concept of hell if you consider it in the light of it being a choice that we have made. He gives us the opportunity to escape it, it's up to us to do what is necessary to take advantage of that opportunity.
The quotes themselves say more than I can really, but I can say this for sure: my understanding of hell was completely changed by this chapter. More to come next week :-)
Monday, March 28, 2011
Monday, March 21, 2011
A question of call
So you've been wondering what you can help with. Here's a bit of verbal diareahh to get the ball rolling.... excuse the randomness of this post. I'm not sure what I'm trying to say.
Well sister, this blog might help you to see that no matter how far down the path of faith one might be -- it never fully resolves itself. As much as I thought I knew what God was up to over here, I am left now, in Lent, in the Wilderness, wondering WTF?
I'm trying my best at my new sister-in-laws Biblestudy. But I got in trouble for swearing. They are really hardcore and don't appreciate so much my relaxed views on faith. I am connecting with them dispite difficulties. The Biblestudy is about marraige and I'm the only one there who has been married for more than a year. So as they bring up issues in marraige I have plenty to share and am not afraid to talk about my life or issues that Ulrich and I have had along the road. It seems to be helpful for them.
I'm studying Romans with Ulrich now and trying to make sense of all the theological differences among all the different churches out there. Realizing the flavor of my faith is distinctly Lutheran. Much of what I believe doesn't jive with what they believe. As they are more Baptist / Non-denominational in their theology.
Also, The girl who moved into the back house has stopped really talking to me and I don't know why and the pastor of our church won't respond to my emails. The church feels daunting and uninviting...even though I've been trying to carve out a space for us there. So again I feel disconnected ... do I need to dig deeper? Am I still not accepting? Or am I not accepting what God has for me? Why can't I connect with people? Or do I not accept the level at which I am connecting with people.
It feels like a wheel out of balance. Wobbly. I feel disjointed and out of place in my communications with people. At the same time, I keep having a sense that I want to pastor folks. Start a church or a new ministry. Or help a pastor build their church. I'm not sure what it is exactly but I feel restless.
Well sister, this blog might help you to see that no matter how far down the path of faith one might be -- it never fully resolves itself. As much as I thought I knew what God was up to over here, I am left now, in Lent, in the Wilderness, wondering WTF?
I'm trying my best at my new sister-in-laws Biblestudy. But I got in trouble for swearing. They are really hardcore and don't appreciate so much my relaxed views on faith. I am connecting with them dispite difficulties. The Biblestudy is about marraige and I'm the only one there who has been married for more than a year. So as they bring up issues in marraige I have plenty to share and am not afraid to talk about my life or issues that Ulrich and I have had along the road. It seems to be helpful for them.
I'm studying Romans with Ulrich now and trying to make sense of all the theological differences among all the different churches out there. Realizing the flavor of my faith is distinctly Lutheran. Much of what I believe doesn't jive with what they believe. As they are more Baptist / Non-denominational in their theology.
Also, The girl who moved into the back house has stopped really talking to me and I don't know why and the pastor of our church won't respond to my emails. The church feels daunting and uninviting...even though I've been trying to carve out a space for us there. So again I feel disconnected ... do I need to dig deeper? Am I still not accepting? Or am I not accepting what God has for me? Why can't I connect with people? Or do I not accept the level at which I am connecting with people.
It feels like a wheel out of balance. Wobbly. I feel disjointed and out of place in my communications with people. At the same time, I keep having a sense that I want to pastor folks. Start a church or a new ministry. Or help a pastor build their church. I'm not sure what it is exactly but I feel restless.
Tuesday, March 8, 2011
CFF Objection #5 Continued...last ...time :-)
Q4: " Isn't it unfair to condemn them [people who live in places where the gospel isn't discussed/allowed] when they never heard about Jesus and merely followed the religious traditions of their parents?"
A4: "We are clearly told that wherever we live - in whatever culture, in whatever nation - he is within reach of every one of us." "If a person genuinely and sincerely seeks after him, there will be some way God makes available for that person to hear of him." "Virtually every Muslim who has come to follow Christ has done so, first, because of the love of Christ expressed through a Christian, or second, because of a vision, a dream, or some other supernatural intervention."
R4: Yet again, the book managed to pinpoint a key issue for me. I think it makes a pretty big claim to report the experiences of "virtually every Muslim" I would be interested to see some sort of data on that...I'm still not sure the response totally tackles the question though - I mean, let's be honest, most Muslims have at least HEARD of Christianity. What about followers of indigenous beliefs in more remote areas (perhaps some smaller African communities would be a good example). Missionaries have not been able to travel to every corner of the globe after all. The response to that, then, would be the "supernatural" approach...again, I would like to see some data/read some testimonies on that. I completely believe that if someone is seeking God, they will find him. But how does someone who is completely removed from even the idea of a monotheistic religion come to the realization that they should be seeking him? If God's purpose in our creation was for us to seek him and create a relationship with him; why would he design it so that some people would be at such a great disadvantage comparatively? If God created Adam and Eve, and they knew he was the creator, how did polytheistic religions even come to be? Is it really believable that that knowledge was somehow lost? Early cultures were so heavily based on story-telling, how could that story be forgotten/so grossly altered? Kind of went off on a tangent there...oh well. Can you tell that I don't really prepare these responses and that I totally fly by the seat of my pants? lol...at least it provides for an authentic response :-)
Q5: "If Jesus is the truth, why do so many people reject him?"
A5: "Because he calls you to die to yourself. Any time truth involves a total commitment in which you bring yourself to complete humility, to the surrender of the will, you will always have resistance. Christ violates our power and autonomy. He challenges us in areas of purity...I have never had a problem knowing what is right and wrong in most situations; what I have lacked is the will to do what is right. That's where Christ comes in. He says if you'll bring all of yourself to him, he will not only give you eternal life, but he will change what you want to do in this life."
R5: That response pretty much hits the nail on the head and doesn't really leave a lot of room for critique. To be a true follower of Christ you really do have to give up your control - which is something that we as humans LOVE to have (I know I certainly do...control freak/perfectionist/I've been called it all...) It is SOOOOO hard to give that up and to truly release yourself from that desire of power. But, the Bible says, "You will seek me and find me when you seek me with all your heart." I would say that there's some misunderstanding of that quote...in the sense that "all your heart" doesn't just mean that you really want to find him...it means that you really want to find him AND that you're willing to follow him regardless of the path he demands. Of course, to some extent we must take control of our own destiny (and you'll never convince me that's not true! lol); but it's been hard work for me to "give it up to God" on the big stuff. BUT - he has delivered when I have...case in point: getting the job offer the day before the wedding.
A4: "We are clearly told that wherever we live - in whatever culture, in whatever nation - he is within reach of every one of us." "If a person genuinely and sincerely seeks after him, there will be some way God makes available for that person to hear of him." "Virtually every Muslim who has come to follow Christ has done so, first, because of the love of Christ expressed through a Christian, or second, because of a vision, a dream, or some other supernatural intervention."
R4: Yet again, the book managed to pinpoint a key issue for me. I think it makes a pretty big claim to report the experiences of "virtually every Muslim" I would be interested to see some sort of data on that...I'm still not sure the response totally tackles the question though - I mean, let's be honest, most Muslims have at least HEARD of Christianity. What about followers of indigenous beliefs in more remote areas (perhaps some smaller African communities would be a good example). Missionaries have not been able to travel to every corner of the globe after all. The response to that, then, would be the "supernatural" approach...again, I would like to see some data/read some testimonies on that. I completely believe that if someone is seeking God, they will find him. But how does someone who is completely removed from even the idea of a monotheistic religion come to the realization that they should be seeking him? If God's purpose in our creation was for us to seek him and create a relationship with him; why would he design it so that some people would be at such a great disadvantage comparatively? If God created Adam and Eve, and they knew he was the creator, how did polytheistic religions even come to be? Is it really believable that that knowledge was somehow lost? Early cultures were so heavily based on story-telling, how could that story be forgotten/so grossly altered? Kind of went off on a tangent there...oh well. Can you tell that I don't really prepare these responses and that I totally fly by the seat of my pants? lol...at least it provides for an authentic response :-)
Q5: "If Jesus is the truth, why do so many people reject him?"
A5: "Because he calls you to die to yourself. Any time truth involves a total commitment in which you bring yourself to complete humility, to the surrender of the will, you will always have resistance. Christ violates our power and autonomy. He challenges us in areas of purity...I have never had a problem knowing what is right and wrong in most situations; what I have lacked is the will to do what is right. That's where Christ comes in. He says if you'll bring all of yourself to him, he will not only give you eternal life, but he will change what you want to do in this life."
R5: That response pretty much hits the nail on the head and doesn't really leave a lot of room for critique. To be a true follower of Christ you really do have to give up your control - which is something that we as humans LOVE to have (I know I certainly do...control freak/perfectionist/I've been called it all...) It is SOOOOO hard to give that up and to truly release yourself from that desire of power. But, the Bible says, "You will seek me and find me when you seek me with all your heart." I would say that there's some misunderstanding of that quote...in the sense that "all your heart" doesn't just mean that you really want to find him...it means that you really want to find him AND that you're willing to follow him regardless of the path he demands. Of course, to some extent we must take control of our own destiny (and you'll never convince me that's not true! lol); but it's been hard work for me to "give it up to God" on the big stuff. BUT - he has delivered when I have...case in point: getting the job offer the day before the wedding.
Subscribe to:
Posts (Atom)